Possible insurance claim against me

[brianbadonde]

I recently cleaned an external wooden door (under a porch). Unbeknown to me the door had been fitted the previous day and not yet been treated. The customer messaged me asking if I had cleaned it. I replied “yes, why? Did it leak?” She said it had leaked, but the real problem is it is a brand new door and hasn’t yet been treated as was supposed to be left 2 days before treating. Me wetting it had left water marks and warped it. I considered my response and said politely if I had known, I wouldn’t have cleaned it. To cut a story short, I will call my insurers tomorrow and see if I am liable. What do people here think? I personally feel I am not at fault but would like other peoples views. My wife says that’s what my insurance is for. Other people have said it’s not my problem. The door cost a grand so that is why the customer is looking to be compensated. Any thoughts?

 

[ched999uk]

In my opinion if you text the night before and the customer didn't tell you not to clean the door then it's not your fault at all.
I you where scheduled to clean and the customer didn't inform you then again it's not your fault.
If you just turn up to clean with no notice then the customer has a little more to whinge about but again how where you to know it was an untreated door.

It's difficult as you don't want to have an argument but fundamentally you cleaned the property as per your original verbal agreement so you did nothing wrong. I don't believe you have been negligent at all.

What would have happened if it had rained over the 2 days when the door was fitted? Surely if the door was that delicate until it was treated the installer should have protected it - I would say the installer or the customer has been negligent.

 

[Pjj]

I am very surprised you cleaning an external door will warp it , but you did clean it so I would say you are liable , if I thought something was new and not completed we would not clean it and would leave a note explaining why we hadn’t done it . I feel your wife is right , unfortunately it’s an expensive learning curve .

 

[Pjj]

In my opinion if you text the night before and the customer didn't tell you not to clean the door then it's not your fault at all.
I you where scheduled to clean and the customer didn't inform you then again it's not your fault.
If you just turn up to clean with no notice then the customer has a little more to whinge about but again how where you to know it was an untreated door.

It's difficult as you don't want to have an argument but fundamentally you cleaned the property as per your original verbal agreement so you did nothing wrong. I don't believe you have been negligent at all.

What would have happened if it had rained over the 2 days when the door was fitted? Surely if the door was that delicate until it was treated the installer should have protected it - I would say the installer or the customer has been negligent.

It’s not usually that difficult to see that an external wooded door isn’t finished ie with paint or stain etc I would say it’s lack of observation from the cleaner , ime not having a go but if it’s a new door that’s not finished you should be able to spot it a mile off

 

[ched999uk]

It’s not usually that difficult to see that an external wooded door isn’t finished ie with paint or stain etc I would say it’s lack of observation from the cleaner , ime not having a go but if it’s a new door that’s not finished you should be able to spot it a mile off

I do get your point but what would happen if it had just been varnished and not dried and you turned up and 'cleaned it'?

I have seen lots of unfinished oak being used outside for all sorts of structural construction and that gets wet, I might have been inclined to think it's similar to that and can handle water no problems.

How could you tell if the silicon from a new installation was dry? Should we be expected to contact the customer if we suspect something has been installed, changed colour etc?

Surely if a customer wanted to deviate from their usual clean then they have the responsibility to inform you?

Definitely an interesting situation.

 

[Scrubsy]

I recently cleaned an external wooden door (under a porch). Unbeknown to me the door had been fitted the previous day and not yet been treated. The customer messaged me asking if I had cleaned it. I replied “yes, why? Did it leak?” She said it had leaked, but the real problem is it is a brand new door and hasn’t yet been treated as was supposed to be left 2 days before treating. Me wetting it had left water marks and warped it. I considered my response and said politely if I had known, I wouldn’t have cleaned it. To cut a story short, I will call my insurers tomorrow and see if I am liable. What do people here think? I personally feel I am not at fault but would like other peoples views. My wife says that’s what my insurance is for. Other people have said it’s not my problem. The door cost a grand so that is why the customer is looking to be compensated. Any thoughts?

@brianbadonde did you use water fed pole on it? I know you said it is under a porch but what does the customer do when it rains then? I find it difficult to believe water fed would warp a heavy wooden door that's designed to be used externally even if it hadn't been treated. Sounds to me like the customer/door fitter trying it on because it's been b*llocksed up when it's been fitted. Wood is a pain for swelling/shrinking in different weathers. I know it's a worry but your wife is 100% right that is what your insurance is for

 

[brianbadonde]

In my opinion if you text the night before and the customer didn't tell you not to clean the door then it's not your fault at all.
I you where scheduled to clean and the customer didn't inform you then again it's not your fault.
If you just turn up to clean with no notice then the customer has a little more to whinge about but again how where you to know it was an untreated door.

It's difficult as you don't want to have an argument but fundamentally you cleaned the property as per your original verbal agreement so you did nothing wrong. I don't believe you have been negligent at all.

What would have happened if it had rained over the 2 days when the door was fitted? Surely if the door was that delicate until it was treated the installer should have protected it - I would say the installer or the customer has been negligent.

To be fair if it had rained the porch over hangs quite a bit so doubt very much it would have got wet at all. As for texting, her gate isn’t locked so I just turn up every couple of months and clean and out an invoice through the door and she pays; has been this way for maybe 6 years. It’s a poser as I feel torn between keeping the peace but also don’t feel liable.

 

[Bell Pallisey]

be suprised if insurance will cover that .Its unfortunate but its a lesson learned isnt it? never touch a wood door again mate . i once put a damp rag on a dining room table ,when i lifted it up the grain had raised up like a hedgehog! lucky it went back an hour later thank god i didnt try to level it aye .

 

[brianbadonde]

It’s not usually that difficult to see that an external wooded door isn’t finished ie with paint or stain etc I would say it’s lack of observation from the cleaner , ime not having a go but if it’s a new door that’s not finished you should be able to spot it a mile off

Thanks for the reply. However it wasn’t obvious to me. It looked like the finished product therefore I cleaned it. I’ve seen a lot of wooden doors that look similar so didn’t think anything of it. The old door was outside propped up against a window so I knew it was a new door but had no idea it wasn’t a finished product. I always assumed a door was treated before being hung if an external door.

 

[brianbadonde]

@brianbadonde did you use water fed pole on it? I know you said it is under a porch but what does the customer do when it rains then? I find it difficult to believe water fed would warp a heavy wooden door that's designed to be used externally even if it hadn't been treated. Sounds to me like the customer/door fitter trying it on because it's been b*llocksed up when it's been fitted. Wood is a pain for swelling/shrinking in different weathers. I know it's a worry but your wife is 100% right that is what your insurance is for

Yes I used water fed pole on it as have done on countless other wooden doors.

 

[brianbadonde]

be suprised if insurance will cover that .Its unfortunate but its a lesson learned isnt it? never touch a wood door again mate . i once put a damp rag on a dining room table ,when i lifted it up the grain had raised up like a hedgehog! lucky it went back an hour later thank god i didnt try to level it aye .

Definitely a lesson learned!

 

[brianbadonde]

Anyway, I’ll contact insurance, and if they say yes, then fine. If they say no, they won’t pay as I am not at fault then I will get them to send me this by email or text so I can forward on to customer.

I’m not bothered about losing a customer from a financial point of view as have more then enough but I hate to leave a bad taste in peoples mouths. I like having a good reputation in my town and would hate to think Im being bad-mouthed.

 

[Scrubsy]

Yes I used water fed pole on it as have done on countless other wooden doors.

I understand the water marks mate, but warping a door would be very difficult in that short space of time.

 

[brianbadonde]

I understand the water marks mate, but warping a door would be very difficult in that short space of time.

Yeah, we will see. I’ll keep this thread posted.

Think this is the first major complaint I’ve had in 10 years. Only ever had the very occasional “you missed a window” which I have always swiftly rectified; we are only human after all!

 

[Scrubsy]

Yeah, we will see. I’ll keep this thread posted.

Think this is the first major complaint I’ve had in 10 years. Only ever had the very occasional “you missed a window” which I have always swiftly rectified; we are only human after all!

Absolutely mate. Hope it goes ok for you

 

[Iron Giant]

Assuming that it took you 30 seconds to clean the door that's around 2.5 ltrs of water no way on this earth is that amount of water going to warp a soft wood door let alone what I assume the customer would most likely opted for a hardwood door warping just isn't going to happen at all, watermarks yes! but a light sand will remove any watermarks a paint or satin just slightly darker than the colour of the wood will hide anything staining as well

 

[brianbadonde]

Yes it’s definitely a very sturdy looking door, solid looking.

 

[dazmond]

If you have basic liability insurance no way will the insurance pay out,it's for if your hurt a member of the public by your actions not property!

Personally I would not admit liability and dump the customer as there is no way you will have warped a door in 2 mins of wfpoling it

She's trying it on....

 

[brianbadonde]

It says it covers damage against property. I haven’t admitted liability or said sorry, I just said that if I’d known then I wouldn’t have cleaned it. I will check with the insurance but I can’t see they will pay either.

 

[Crystalalan]

She hasn't got a leg to stand on. If she hadn't told you in advance then how were you to know? You're a window cleaner after all not a door specialist

 

[ched999uk]

It says it covers damage against property. I haven’t admitted liability or said sorry, I just said that if I’d known then I wouldn’t have cleaned it. I will check with the insurance but I can’t see they will pay either.

Just be aware that some policies don't cover what you are actually working on! So they would cover your pole hitting a customers car but might not cover your pole breaking a window!
Check your policy vary carefully.