Gutter clearing off a ladder

[laddergarder]

A ladder is inherently unsafe - working at height is inherently unsafe. Working at height off a ladder compounds the risk…exponentially. I know three windies hospitalised - one fell two feet, one fell 12 feet airambulanced, one ~16ft. All sustained broken bones and one was in hospital for 1~2 months. They all gave up their ladder work.

That said I have two constantly in the van (plus a tower) but crucially mine look like Xmas trees with several built in safety features and/or after market aids used/fitted.

Falling from height (defined as >2ft) is the number one killer of UK working men - and ladders play a large part in that or rather they did a few years ago less nowdays because much fewer workers use them.

Do your ladders have/use any additional safety features eg wider stabiliser bar at base, splayed or self levelling feet, anakland stabilisers at sides, laddermate, ladder mats or stand off at top etc?

If you combine a few of the safety features you can dramatically improve their safety. But using them for every job every day is playing russian roulette imho. As you age your bones become increasingly brittle. Switch to WFP you’ll not go back.

Imho a guttervac is essential - it will pay for itself within the first week or two. Not sure anyone goes back to clearing it manually - unless the job dictates it. It enables you to bid/secure commercial work which could cover the initial outlay on the first or second job.
Your productivity will increase and will you’ll not miss all the cuts and scuffs from groping around in gutters.

There is clear risks while working at heights. No arguments. However not all falls from height involved ladders. Very few of the ones that do involve ladders are window cleaners.

There was one window cleaner killed last year from a fall from heights.

Here is where I am getting that from:

2022-23 names and details of fatalities

www.hse.gov.uk

One too many.

However by those fatalities, you would be doing a more dangerous job working in a garage fixing cars.

The risk has to be mitigated. Well maintained, used properly, well trained in there use. Safety devices used where necessary and appropriate.

I will use ladder mats or wedges to level ladders. I use deckies to secure the ladder on decking. You can buy the from B&Q. If I am in any doubt I can clean most windows with a trad pole and moerman accelerator with flip pads. I have used Wfp in the past as well. My ladders are 17ft. I don't go any higher than that, which mitigates the risk. I also have nearly 20 years experience working at heights, so my judgement is often my best safety device.

 

[Pjj]

There is clear risks while working at heights. No arguments. However not all falls from height involved ladders. Very few of the ones that do involve ladders are window cleaners.

There was one window cleaner killed last year from a fall from heights.

Here is where I am getting that from:

2022-23 names and details of fatalities

www.hse.gov.uk

One too many.

However by those fatalities, you would be doing a more dangerous job working in a garage fixing cars.

The risk has to be mitigated. Well maintained, used properly, well trained in there use. Safety devices used where necessary and appropriate.

I will use ladder mats or wedges to level ladders. I use deckies to secure the ladder on decking. You can buy the from B&Q. If I am in any doubt I can clean most windows with a trad pole and moerman accelerator with flip pads. I have used Wfp in the past as well. My ladders are 17ft. I don't go any higher than that, which mitigates the risk. I also have nearly 20 years experience working at heights, so my judgement is often my best safety device.

You don’t need to be high up to die from a fall , one of the guys from our fire stations his son was climbing over a 5 bar gate slipped and hit his head on the ground from less than 5 feet and died

 

[laddergarder]

You don’t need to be high up to die from a fall , one of the guys from our fire stations his son was climbing over a 5 bar gate slipped and hit his head on the ground from less than 5 feet and died

Yeah I get that. I believe people die falling out of their bed. Tripping in the street and dying. There is risk in everything. People needlessly jump out of planes for thrills, with deaths happening every year.

No one is going to ban skydiving, because considering the volume of jumps every year, the risks are fairly minimal. Common sense is applied.

 

[Lee mappley]

A ladder is inherently unsafe - working at height is inherently unsafe. Working at height off a ladder compounds the risk…exponentially. I know three windies hospitalised - one fell two feet, one fell 12 feet airambulanced, one ~16ft. All sustained broken bones and one was in hospital for 1~2 months. They all gave up their ladder work.

That said I have two constantly in the van (plus a tower) but crucially mine look like Xmas trees with several built in safety features and/or after market aids used/fitted.

Falling from height (defined as >2ft) is the number one killer of UK working men - and ladders play a large part in that or rather they did a few years ago less nowdays because much fewer workers use them.

Do your ladders have/use any additional safety features eg wider stabiliser bar at base, splayed or self levelling feet, anakland stabilisers at sides, laddermate, ladder mats or stand off at top etc?

If you combine a few of the safety features you can dramatically improve their safety. But using them for every job every day is playing russian roulette imho. As you age your bones become increasingly brittle. Switch to WFP you’ll not go back.

Imho a guttervac is essential - it will pay for itself within the first week or two. Not sure anyone goes back to clearing it manually - unless the job dictates it. It enables you to bid/secure commercial work which could cover the initial outlay on the first or second job.
Your productivity will increase and will you’ll not miss all the cuts and scuffs from groping around in gutters.

What gutter vac would you recommend for a first timer? Do 20/30 a year

 

[NoName]

What gutter vac would you recommend for a first timer? Do 20/30 a year

You tend to get what you pay for - definitely do a thorough review on here etc for feedback from longtime owners (everyone’s always impressed with their just bought shinny new vac-different case after a few years later) to build a short list. I’ve got a Numatic from Grippavac. But to be fair it’s a bit like Triggers broom by now - have replaced 3 motors one handle and handle lockm etc. Have used a Skyvac too which was very impressive (really like their poles which were much more robust than Grippa’s). I fancy an interceptor once mine finally dies. Depends on your typical customers smaller/larger premises or mix, etc. Best buy a reliable brand - once you’ve paid you’ll soon forget the initial outlay but appreciate the everyday quality/reliability. Personally I always think buying the best you can afford is shrewd - cheaper products are cheaper for a reason.

 

[Part Timer]

You tend to get what you pay for - definitely do a thorough review on here etc for feedback from longtime owners (everyone’s always impressed with their just bought shinny new vac-different case after a few years later) to build a short list. I’ve got a Numatic from Grippavac. But to be fair it’s a bit like Triggers broom by now - have replaced 3 motors one handle and handle lockm etc. Have used a Skyvac too which was very impressive (really like their poles which were much more robust than Grippa’s). I fancy an interceptor once mine finally dies. Depends on your typical customers smaller/larger premises or mix, etc. Best buy a reliable brand - once you’ve paid you’ll soon forget the initial outlay but appreciate the everyday quality/reliability. Personally I always think buying the best you can afford is shrewd - cheaper products are cheaper for a reason.

If I were you I'd get an Inteceptor now and have your old vac as an emergency spare just in case. It really is a game changer if you have big commercual gutter jobs

 

[NoName]

There is clear risks while working at heights. No arguments. However not all falls from height involved ladders. Very few of the ones that do involve ladders are window cleaners.

There was one window cleaner killed last year from a fall from heights.

Here is where I am getting that from:

2022-23 names and details of fatalities

www.hse.gov.uk

One too many.

However by those fatalities, you would be doing a more dangerous job working in a garage fixing cars.

The risk has to be mitigated. Well maintained, used properly, well trained in there use. Safety devices used where necessary and appropriate.

I will use ladder mats or wedges to level ladders. I use deckies to secure the ladder on decking. You can buy the from B&Q. If I am in any doubt I can clean most windows with a trad pole and moerman accelerator with flip pads. I have used Wfp in the past as well. My ladders are 17ft. I don't go any higher than that, which mitigates the risk. I also have nearly 20 years experience working at heights, so my judgement is often my best safety device.

Fair play. You obviously know the risks in what you’re doing.
Very few windies are going to voluntarily report their near misses (HSE requirement) or even accidents to the HSE - I know I’ve never - nor anybody of the three hospitalised I mentioned - so these HSE figures will be heavily underestimated and weighted for larger businesses with HSE reps and reporting procedures etc. I guarantee every single regular user of a ladders will have a scary tale to tell - once we swallow the pride. I use a number of mitigations but have still had a few near misses - when I started doing roofs I did them initially off a ladder. Can’t describe the difference doing it from a mobile scaffold tower makes - my calfs used to ache like Billy o - all a thing of the past- it actually makes the job much more enjoyable.

Each of the three I know who had accidents say they *never* really had any issues before - you only need tob be *unlucky* once out of the hundreds of times you step on a rung. Even with all my safety addons I once had my triple blow sideways and down onto a customers conservatory- thankfully no damage but I had just stepped off it to empty a bucket.
It was high and in an exposed position though.

If you’re wedded to you ladders - fair enough - wisdom is usually the result of experience - it’s just best if you we can learn from others mistakes rather than personally.

 

[NoName]

If I were you I'd get an Inteceptor now and have your old vac as an emergency spare just in case. It really is a game changer if you have big commercual gutter jobs

Exactly - that’s precisely the plan!

 

[Crystalalan]

What gutter vac would you recommend for a first timer? Do 20/30 a year

I can highly recommend GVS 1700watt panther. I`ve had mine over two years now and it hasnt put a foot wrong. Real sturdy little bugger with great suction. I`m quite intrigued by the sky vac mighty atom as it has a blow function which I think is a fantastic feature.

 

[Bell Pallisey]

It does not cost that much more to get extra insurance for cleaning out gutters if anything but you need to mention it to insurance co , and if you go on to doing repairs too extra insurance for that did not cost me much under a 100 but you also must realize the consequence of tackling repairs .Iv held back on putting back a loose tile because of that.Back when i was 16 i worked for a local chimney sweep who took on replacing a roof,all went well but then he had measured the spacing of the battens by a quarter of an inch short which meant when we got near the roof line it was 1 line of tiles short! he had to buy and fit in an extra line which looked a bit daft

 

[Part Timer]

We do the odd repair but don't charge and tell them it's a temporary repair and they need to get someone in to do a proper repair.

 

[ched999uk]

I can highly recommend GVS 1700watt panther. I`ve had mine over two years now and it hasnt put a foot wrong. Real sturdy little bugger with great suction. I`m quite intrigued by the sky vac mighty atom as it has a blow function which I think is a fantastic featu

From my research the Mighty Atom has quite a restriction on the inlet (it drops in diameter quite a bit), so no matter what poles you use the choke point it at the vac its self.
The only thing I would quite like on the GVS Panther is a water drain pipe, maybe a stronger blue foam filter.

 

[Pjj]

From my research the Mighty Atom has quite a restriction on the inlet (it drops in diameter quite a bit), so no matter what poles you use the choke point it at the vac its self.
The only thing I would quite like on the GVS Panther is a water drain pipe, maybe a stronger blue foam filter.

I don’t find the water drain pipe any use at all they let out a cup full of water and that’s it it gets blocked by debris. You can buy a basket for my interceptor but it’s nearly £400 don’t feel it’s worth spending that plus it also dramatically reduced the drum capacity.

 

[Windamon]

A ladder is inherently unsafe - working at height is inherently unsafe. Working at height off a ladder compounds the risk…exponentially. I know three windies hospitalised - one fell two feet, one fell 12 feet airambulanced, one ~16ft. All sustained broken bones and one was in hospital for 1~2 months. They all gave up their ladder work.

That said I have two constantly in the van (plus a tower) but crucially mine look like Xmas trees with several built in safety features and/or after market aids used/fitted.

Falling from height (defined as >2ft) is the number one killer of UK working men - and ladders play a large part in that or rather they did a few years ago less nowdays because much fewer workers use them.

Do your ladders have/use any additional safety features eg wider stabiliser bar at base, splayed or self levelling feet, anakland stabilisers at sides, laddermate, ladder mats or stand off at top etc?

If you combine a few of the safety features you can dramatically improve their safety. But using them for every job every day is playing russian roulette imho. As you age your bones become increasingly brittle. Switch to WFP you’ll not go back.

Imho a guttervac is essential - it will pay for itself within the first week or two. Not sure anyone goes back to clearing it manually - unless the job dictates it. It enables you to bid/secure commercial work which could cover the initial outlay on the first or second job.
Your productivity will increase and will you’ll not miss all the cuts and scuffs from groping around in gutters.

Get a life pal.use the brains you were given,practice common sense and you will be fine at any height working from a ladder.all this health and safety stuff is over rated and poncy.

 

[NoName]

Get a life pal.use the brains you were given,practice common sense and you will be fine at any height working from a ladder.all this health and safety stuff is over rated and poncy.

Have you every received any H&S training? Ignorance is bliss.
What is poncy is dying or being maimed disabled for life from ignorance.

According to UKs Health and Safety Executive the No 1 cause of death of UK working men in 22/23 was - falling from height. As it has been every single year since they started to record deaths at work. That’s 40 men no longer alive because they fell - in one single year.
Says it all really pal.

My mate who was airlifted to hospital has plates and screws in various body parts, had a fractured skull and nearly had his arm amputated due to fall - from a 10ft single story roof (onto flags) He stays on the ground now when working.

That’s your opinion pal which you are of course entitled to - after all it’s your health and likely no one else you put at risk.

Bravado is best left for the pub not the workplace imho.

It’s not manly or’ard to take unnecessary risks which simply don’t need to be taken.

Do you ever not bother looking both ways at junctions because you’ve never had a crash?

First step on a risk assessment is - does a ladder need to be used - is their an another safer access method. Hierarchy of controls


Most men are too macho to admit they have had an accident hence they don’t share their bad experiences or they don’t live to tell their tale.

I use ladders - but combined them with as many inbuilt and aftermarket safety features as practical. It takes virtually no extra time and significantly eradicates ladder bounce or prevent stiles slipping out or etc. easy simple and sensible steps we all can take - which greatly reduces the risk that someone on this forum will suffer serious harm from simply not mitigating the very real risks of ladder use.

 

[Dave B]

Have you every received any H&S training? Ignorance is bliss.
What is poncy is dying or being maimed disabled for life from ignorance.

According to UKs Health and Safety Executive the No 1 cause of death of UK working men in 22/23 was - falling from height. As it has been every single year since they started to record deaths at work. That’s 40 men no longer alive because they fell - in one single year.
Says it all really pal.

My mate who was airlifted to hospital has plates and screws in various body parts, had a fractured skull and nearly had his arm amputated due to fall - from a 10ft single story roof (onto flags) He stays on the ground now when working.

That’s your opinion pal which you are of course entitled to - after all it’s your health and likely no one else you put at risk.

Bravado is best left for the pub not the workplace imho.

It’s not manly or’ard to take unnecessary risks which simply don’t need to be taken.

Do you ever not bother looking both ways at junctions because you’ve never had a crash?

First step on a risk assessment is - does a ladder need to be used - is their an another safer access method. Hierarchy of controls

View attachment 29877
Most men are too macho to admit they have had an accident hence they don’t share their bad experiences or they don’t live to tell their tale.

I use ladders - but combined them with as many inbuilt and aftermarket safety features as practical. It takes virtually no extra time and significantly eradicates ladder bounce or prevent stiles slipping out or etc. easy simple and sensible steps we all can take - which greatly reduces the risk that someone on this forum will suffer serious harm from simply not mitigating the very real risks of ladder use.

I have deformed fingers on left hand due to a fall and have broken/fractured vertebrae in the past due to ladder falls
Not fun being in pain every winter due to arthritis from the damage
If only there was a safer way to work

 

[nick666]

Yeah I get that. I believe people die falling out of their bed. Tripping in the street and dying. There is risk in everything. People needlessly jump out of planes for thrills, with deaths happening every year.

No one is going to ban skydiving, because considering the volume of jumps every year, the risks are fairly minimal. Common sense is applied.

Google any skydiving club and put fatalities in search-put me off jumping

 

[southcoastkev]

Blimey this thread has taken quite a sinister turn

 

[NoName]

I have deformed fingers on left hand due to a fall and have broken/fractured vertebrae in the past due to ladder falls
Not fun being in pain every winter due to arthritis from the damage
If only there was a safer way to work

Sorry to hear that Dave - it’s sadly an all too familiar story - reckon every single ladder user has a *story* to tell - it’s not the ladder we need to worry about but immutable gravity.

Would be good if more felt brave enough to honestly share their - when it hits the fan ladder stories - think most have one or two in them!

 

[Windamon]

Have you every received any H&S training? Ignorance is bliss.
What is poncy is dying or being maimed disabled for life from ignorance.

According to UKs Health and Safety Executive the No 1 cause of death of UK working men in 22/23 was - falling from height. As it has been every single year since they started to record deaths at work. That’s 40 men no longer alive because they fell - in one single year.
Says it all really pal.

My mate who was airlifted to hospital has plates and screws in various body parts, had a fractured skull and nearly had his arm amputated due to fall - from a 10ft single story roof (onto flags) He stays on the ground now when working.

That’s your opinion pal which you are of course entitled to - after all it’s your health and likely no one else you put at risk.

Bravado is best left for the pub not the workplace imho.

It’s not manly or’ard to take unnecessary risks which simply don’t need to be taken.

Do you ever not bother looking both ways at junctions because you’ve never had a crash?

First step on a risk assessment is - does a ladder need to be used - is their an another safer access method. Hierarchy of controls

View attachment 29877
Most men are too macho to admit they have had an accident hence they don’t share their bad experiences or they don’t live to tell their tale.

I use ladders - but combined them with as many inbuilt and aftermarket safety features as practical. It takes virtually no extra time and significantly eradicates ladder bounce or prevent stiles slipping out or etc. easy simple and sensible steps we all can take - which greatly reduces the risk that someone on this forum will suffer serious harm from simply not mitigating the very real risks of ladder use.

Woke and boring, just sayin.
Kind regards

 

[Dave B]

Woke and boring, just sayin.
Kind regards

Not really it’s called being safe and going home at the end of the day